What a good first phone call with a clinic sounds like

Ring, ring. Oh my God. Performance place. This is Nathan. How can I help you? Hey, how much for a quick adjustment? You're listening to the Restoring Human Movement podcast, where movement experts discuss the latest evidence-based practices to help you and your clients move with mastery. And now, your host, Dr. Sebastian Gonzales. Hey guys, it's Dr. Sebastian Gonzales, your host with the Restoring Human Movement podcast. Thanks for joining the movement movement. This is going to be a fun one today. I actually had a handful of people on, and we did the game of Ring, Ring. It's the 10-minute rule that I've talked about a handful of times on the podcast. I think, depending upon where I place this podcast, you might have heard it last week, we had Mark Murdoch. Mark Murdoch was, he's going to be episode 150. I think it's going to be 151.

And so, we went over the Ring, Ring game. And I think what I've learned is one of the hardest things to do. Getting someone to actually come in to see you. And they might express interest, and they want to come in. They want to solve a problem, but they don't always know if you're the right fit for them. They might be concerned about price. They might be concerned about, does he know what he's talking about? Maybe they thought, well, I think maybe tissue work is going to help me with this, but this person said he doesn't do tissue work. So, therefore, I feel like this person's wrong for me. You know, and maybe you could have helped that person through that problem still, but you didn't communicate that you could do that. You just said you didn't do tissue work.

And we actually had a person call the other day. It was a fun one where I had my intern answer the phone. And he did a really good job. And at the end, I said, how'd that go? And he's like, well, the person said they're really looking for tissue work for their hamstring scar tissue because they want to finish off their last couple races of the year. And they really just needed it to be addressed. And I guess, quote unquote, patchwork. And I said, well, what'd you say? And he said, well, aren't you interested in getting into the root of the problem and fixing it more for the long term? And I said, I like it, Mike. I like what you said. But at the same time, what I'm hearing right now is that they're looking for something to get through the next couple of weeks.

And there's a possible interpretation. They thought you meant that what you're going to supply will not get them there. And you're thinking long term, right? And so I called her back and I said, hey, I want you to know, like, I overheard you talking to the front desk and I want you to know that the results you're looking for to get through the next couple of races and feel really good are possible by what we're talking about. But it might not include tissue work. So I think clear communication with people on the phone to let them know that you can help them to their goal is really important. And it's an art form of doing it. And so what I did here in this podcast is I basically took, I took everyone through.

I called I called one guy randomly and he he he answered the phone in his own practice. And so I had a couple of interns come into the office here and I didn't even tell him what I was doing. I said, hey, we're going to talk here. And I just started out ring ring. And so I just want to see what they're going to say. And you see, the last guy is that's Nathan. We've already played this game quite a bit. And he's like, oh, God, like this is like you hear the disdain in his voice that I can't believe I'm doing this right now. And so I encourage you guys, if you find that this this is you, if you feel the hesitation on some of their voices or if you think mine is better or if you think Mark is better from last week and then some of the people on here and you kind of find yourself getting disinterested with what one of us has to say.

Improve on that, because I bet if you play this game with another with another clinician, you're going to suck, too. And I think I'm much better than I have been, but I've sucked for a very long time at this. And so listen to this podcast. I think you're going to find a lot of benefit from it. Let's get into that personal story real quickly. So you guys understand a little bit more about me and then we'll go right into the ring ring game. All right. Quick story about me. We had a debate in the office about my interns are talking about sprinting, sprinting distance. And so she was like, well, sprint distance, that's 800 to sprint. 400 set, certainly a sprint.

I'm like, no, no, no, 400 is not a sprint. And so she's like, what do you mean it's not a sprint? I'm like, well, I'm like, I think anytime you actually have a forward lean, it's a sprint. And she's like, well, you're kind of forward lean. I'm like, yeah, but you're not leaning. You're not out of the blocks. You're not sprinting to another base. And I'm like, I think sprinting is really within like the first three steps, really. You should hit max speed in three steps. After that, you're kind of like holding pace or decelerating. So I'm like, that's not sprinting because we were talking about having a sprinting race and see if she can beat me or not.

And so finally we got the cat. I thought I was going to beat her on this. And I said, OK, when is when does anaerobic energy system stop? She said one minute. And I'm like, well, and she's like, is a 400 one minute? I'm like, well, mine's not. And she's like, yeah. And I'm like, damn. OK, you're right. Maybe 400 is the top of the sprint there. But I don't think anything beyond is. But I'm sticking to my leaning aspect as a sprint team because I like to feel good about like that. I feel like I'm a sprinter. Distance ain't for me. And so she's like, you should be able to do 400. I'm like, it's not a sprint.

Anyways, let's get into the content. RSM Sports Medicine Rehab. This is Dr. Jeremy. Hey, so do you guys take insurance, Aetna? No, we don't take insurance. Actually, we're a cash based practice. Oh, so I was really looking for someone who would take my insurance. I have chiropractic coverage and it was only like a $10 copay. What we do is we do do a free discovery session where you can come in. We'll do a 30-minute evaluation quick, get to know you, get to know you a little bit about your goals and see if you fit in here with us. So what is, I mean, so does my insurance cover that treatment or I just, I mean, I don't want to pay a lot out of pocket because I know that it's covered in my insurance, you know?

Yeah, no, the first discovery visit is totally free. Nobody loses anything if it's not a right fit for you. But you get to see if you would like it here at RSM. Okay. Are you guys good with, are you guys good with backs? Yeah, well, I am a chiropractor. So low backs is a specialty that we see all the time at our practice. But we treat a variety of injuries ranging from knee pain, elbow pain, shoulder pain, hip pain, and so on. Okay. So I guess, can I just book that online then or? Yeah, you can book it online or we can take your information right now and we can find a spot that fits in for both of us.

Okay. You know, let me just actually talk it over with my wife and actually I'll give you a call back. Okay, sounds good. Before you leave, can I take down your number or contact information? Yeah, yeah. My name is Seymour Butts. Got it. And it's 999. 999. 275. Wait, never mind. I don't want to give you that number. Let me just give you, let me give you a different number. I'll give you my office line. Okay. 714. 562. 4243. Great. But yeah, I need to talk it over to my wife a little bit and just see if, you know, it's something that we could do, you know? Absolutely. I know it's, yeah, it's not too common to pay out of pocket every visit for a chiropractor, but what we do is a little bit differently.

Every session is one-on-one with you. We go through a thorough exam and we really take care of our patients, find out what your goal is, and everything's customized to your goals and what works best for you. Okay, so just, actually, question is, how much, I mean, how much, if, say my insurance doesn't cover, like, what does it typically cost, you know, for someone to come in a couple times and, I mean, I got a back thing and it's just been on and off for years and I just, I mean, how long does it usually go? Because I don't really want to go forever, I hear that's what chiropractors do, you know?

Yeah, well, that's a good part about our practice is we try to get you out of pain as fast as possible in the most efficient way. And the reason for our high prices is because we try to get you out, you know, within a month or two. And you learn about your injury so you can do all these treatments and rehab protocols at home without me outside the clinic. So, typically, the initial visit is $150 and every other visit after that would be $100. But we do do packages depending on the severity of the injury, how long you want to be with us. And, you know, we tailor it to what you need. We don't give you a set date on every day that you have to come in.

And we try to work, you know, together to get the best outcomes for you. Okay, cool. Then I will talk to my wife and let you know. Sounds good. I hope to hear from you soon. Okay. Take care. Bye. Oh, yeah. Hello? Hey, thank you for calling Performance Place. How can I help you? Hey, I called earlier. I was just looking to come in for a quick adjustment, you know, just like a little pop in the neck. I have this little tight thing in my neck and I don't know what it is. I just want to get it cracked. Okay. Well, let me ask you a couple questions first because I just want to make sure that you're calling right place.

Sure, yeah. You take insurance, by the way? Sometimes. But it's all going to be based upon really what you're going to tell me right now. So, if you're going to allow me to, let me ask you a couple questions, okay? Yeah, sure. Cool. I mean, have you had this neck pain a long time? No, but I usually get adjusted by my chiropractor back at home. But now I'm at school and I just, I don't have anybody. And I know that I just usually get this same exact feeling. And he just uses this little gun on my neck and then it pops it back in and then I'm free to go. Oh, what kind of school are you going to, actually?

Were you at school out here? Yeah, I'm going to USC. Oh, nice. Cool. Yeah. Right on. And so, how long do those, does your results last with something like that? It goes away and then it comes back like a week later. But I figured I sleep wrong or something. I don't know. Yeah. And so, is there any issues in the arm, mid-back, any headaches, things like that? No, just slight headaches and then like that pinch on that one side. Okay. And I forget, I don't know if you answered, how long you had that? Like how many years? It's been going on for a couple months. Okay. Yeah. And have you tried any rehab for it or is it only you've only tried adjusting or you've tried other things too?

No, I don't, I don't, I'm not too good with rehab. I just, usually just, he either rubs it out or does that little thing with the gun and then I'm free to go. And then comes back like usually a week and a half sometimes, a week later. Okay. So, I'm just kind of asking these questions because I want to make sure that if you do come here, you'd be in the right place. And honestly, what it sounds like is you found something that does work for you but it's only lasting for about a week and a half. And so, what I would suggest is, I always believe in the insanity rule. Like if you've tried something over and over again, you should expect different results.

And so, honestly, I would try something different with you. I probably wouldn't even adjust it. I'd try different things. Really? Yeah. And I'll tell you a story. I've had, actually, I remember this one lady that came in that she had, she had some neck pain. Well, it's also, she had some kind of this mid-back tightness and went down kind of between her shoulder blades. She didn't have any hand numbs or anything like that but had headaches as well, just like you. And so, we were able to get that to go away and she had it for a couple of years but it only took about like five sessions to really get rid of it.

And at the very end, actually, all it took was a little bit of, we call it skin pulling. And we just pulled in the skin and it took all of her symptoms away. And it doesn't always work but it's like the easiest thing that you could do on yourself and you don't need to keep coming back to people every week, you know? Really? Yeah. And so, I don't know. But I feel like it just needs to pop like, you know, like… I go to crack it myself. But it's just stuck. Right. And that's a common feeling. It's a really common one. And just another story and this is a different person but there's this lady who was coming in.

She had this like, so she said her SI joint always needed to be popped. And so, she would keep telling me it needed to be popped and, you know, she had gone to someone else. They tried to pop it. It wouldn't go. And we got that to go away in a different way as well. It was her actually, her feeling of popping in the joint was actually disc-related. And so, when it's disc-related, we treat it in a different way which is basically she was doing some Cobras, like yoga Cobras, and that went away. And so, it's a really common feeling to feel that but it doesn't always mean it's going to be a good long-term solution because it might only last a week or so, you know?

Yeah. But don't I need to be in alignment? It's a good question. I think alignment, if you want to get in the weeds with this, alignment is dynamic. And based upon, I'm guessing you're based upon, you're talking about x-rays? Yeah, like my spinal alignment. Yeah. So, the muscles are really strong and they'll pull you out of alignment too, right? Yeah. So, muscles kind of rule that. So, it's like, honestly, I send people out for images only when I'm looking for fractures and other types of things of that nature. I personally don't look for alignment with it and honestly, I've had a really good results working with necks without adjusting them.

It's just my style. I just don't need to adjust them. They respond extremely well. Neck pain goes away. Headaches go away. Radiating pain to the arm or numbness goes away. And they're really not that hard, you know? Wow. But we just have to treat them in a little different way. Cool. So, I guess back into your original question, no, we really don't take a lot of insurances. And there are some insurances that we do take. Honestly, if you work at like a very large corporation, like say you've got 500 employees, 1,000 employees that are kind of around you, you have a way better chance. But if you're a mom-and-pop shop or you have like 10 people working with you, the chances are really low.

And if I had to guess, I'd say only 15% of our people ever get insurance coverage back. Right? Really? Yeah. And so, I don't want to like extend. I don't want to like act like it's going to cover because honestly, it probably won't. And all the places you've probably called today, we're going to, I'll save you all the trouble, we're more expensive than all of them. Like significantly more expensive. Oh, man. Okay. But so, the prices are more, but the results are going to speak for themselves is all I can tell you. And so, there'll be no surprise when you come in really. Sweet. So, pretty much, you're guaranteeing that I'm going to feel better, but I could go down the street where they take my insurance and maybe feel better?

Possibly, you know, but the rule I kind of give everybody is, and this includes care if you come see me, is if you don't feel like a noticeable, definitive, like, man, this is getting better. Like, this is not coming back type of feeling within about like five or six times, I'm probably doing the wrong thing. I might have missed something in your exam. You know, maybe you need a different type of care than what I'm given. And I'd say the same thing for everybody else. Like, if you're going down there and homeboy had like five, six times with you and you're like, well, this keeps coming back. It's probably the wrong thing, you know, and so everybody has different needs for what their body needs.

But I think when we're making progress, we're making progress. And so you can certainly go down the street and try the guy that takes your insurance, but if you do end up calling back and you feel like you're hitting a stagnant point, just let me know. It's not a big deal. We can just pick up there and I'll just check out and see what's going to work for you. Okay, and how much does your first visit usually cost? So the first exam, it takes a while. I'll be honest with you, the time, I like to spend a bit of time to make sure that we get through all the weeds and make sure we leave any rock not uncovered.

It's $300. It's probably going to take about an hour and 15 minutes or so. All right, it might take a little longer. I've been known to spend two hours in an exam sometimes when I have the time and it takes the need. But we're going to be rolling out things that you probably read about, like your facet syndrome, your cervical disc injuries, your out of alignment, and all that stuff. So if you've ever thought, I wonder if I have that and that's my thing, we're going to roll all that in or out. Okay? Mm-hmm. And how do the payments work? Is it just straight-up cash, credit card, check? Yeah, traveler's checks, right arms, left pinkies.

Sounds good. We do credit cards and whatnot. You can do checks, but when people do, sometimes they get frustrated because we don't go to the bank quick enough. And so if that's you, I wouldn't bother with the check. Got it. Any questions? It seems like you know what you're doing. I just, I'm going to see how I'm going to pay for this. So let me think it through and then I'll get back to you soon. Yeah, sure. Do you want us to follow back up with you? I can, usually email is the quickest way. Like, we're not aggressive with pushing you, but the way I see it is you're calling to find a solution and if you're going to be shuffled around those places looking around, I want to make sure that I'm helping you out, you know?

Yeah. No, absolutely. I think that's a great idea. Okay. And we'll be in touch. Yeah. So what's your email? Let me write it down for you. It's white chocolate. 17. 17? Why? Is that when you're born? No, that was my high school football number. Oh. Is this really an email? At gmail.com. Is this really an email? Because I'm going to email this email. No. My old one was white chocolate. That's why it was so good. Oh, good. Yeah. I'm glad this was a real, this was real. Ring, ring. Hello? Hey, do you guys take insurance at your office? Uh, no. Okay, I'll see you later. All right. Okay. Ring, ring.

Hello? Do you guys take insurance at your office? Um, why are you calling today? Uh, cause I was wondering if I kind of needed a chiropractic adjustment, I think. I, I, I thought I just wanted to, my insurance covers some, so I thought I would just give some places a call. Oh, well, let me hear a little bit more about what's going on. Uh, so I've been getting adjustments for about six months or so, and it's been for my SI joint, and, and it seems like it really takes some pain away for a good, like, five days or so, and so, you know, just kind of that thing. Well, what if we could figure out a way where you could take care of your own pain and, uh, you didn't need to rely on us or a chiropractor for the rest of your life?

Hmm. What, what, what do you mean? What if we could empower you as a patient to, um, basically to provide you with education on what's going on with your own condition and you could check in with me periodically, but in the long run, it's going to be up to you to take your, your health into your own hands. So, like, what does that, does that mean? Like, I still, you know, I still get like the same kind of treatment or like, how does that change anything? You know, every patient's different. So I don't want to say that you're going to get a certain type of treatment when you come in. Um, that all depends on your history, you know, and your goals of where you want to be.

But I can tell you that you will leave here feeling better. Okay. So, I mean, I've been, the guy that I was going to, he just, he just kind of, he started to stop taking insurance. So I just thought I, uh, you know, I stopped going there is, uh, you know, the cost is kind of a thing for me is, uh, like, what do you, what typically is a, is a cost for something like this if, if I don't do insurance? Um, well, the cost here is blah, blah, blah. Uh, and we believe that once you come in, you'll see value in what we do. And, uh, the treatment plan, when you think about it is potentially less than five visits.

Um, and if you think about how typical chiropractors will build, they'll have you come in two or three times a week for four or six weeks. And if you add that up, it's actually more, you're paying out of pocket than if you come see me a few times at a higher cost. Okay. And, and how, so I, how are you, like, how are you different? Cause I, I imagine that it's, uh, like why, why only like five times? Like, why do you think that'll be like enough? Cause I feel like I needed it like every week. Yeah. The interesting thing was an adjustment as you get an endorphin released right afterwards. And it's, uh, basically we're causing a neurological change temporarily and you feel better and it may, may last for a day or two, but in the long run, it might not be doing what you really need to be done.

So with the active care model that we provide here, we empower you to, like I said, take your health into, uh, your own hands. And if there's, there's a restriction and we need to mobilize it to get you moving better, we will, but we need to reinforce that with strength training and stabilization exercises and things like that. So you can lift your kid up, you know, you can pick your kid up, you can, you know, do your groceries. You can sit at work throughout the day without any problems. And in the long run, you're going to be a healthier, happier individual. Okay, cool. So how do I book a time?

Um, I'm going to have you go online. Okay. You, you figure out, you figured out what we were doing. Yeah. Okay. Um, so I didn't know if you wanted me to make it for your office particularly, or how it would just be a hypothetical office. Cause I know. So here's what this podcast is, by the way, I'll, uh, I might include this part. I might not. And so I'm doing random phone calls or, or conversations with people about, Hey, Hey, how's it going? Um, you know, do you take insurance or do you, how much work adjustment or things like that? Cause those are the phone calls you're going to get. Yeah. And so I wanted to see how, how far you go.

So this was uncoached. Right. Okay. You want constructive criticism on these ones? Yeah. Okay. Uh, I would imagine like I, it was intriguing. So you went down the good route, I think, but at the same time they were generalistic answers. Yeah. And so what I would, what I'd love to see is, so do you personally know someone that you've worked with where they've had a repeated SI doing adjustment and then you, you helped them in the way that you just spoke about? Yeah. So tell, tell me that story. Okay. Um, let's see. Would it have to be SI or could it be like cervical or anything? So, so it would have to relate to the person's question.

Right. So I tend, I don't know if you know this in the office, I tend to have, I tend to have a story in the back pocket, something like that. Yeah. Um, let me think. You got your own personal story. I do. Yeah. That'll work too. Yeah. I think in here, I think it'll be the best one. It's good to have them right on hand. Um, low back. Uh, that, that'll work. It depends on the patient, like you said, right? Well, so they might, this caller might say, they say that they're saying SI, but we don't know what SI is to them. Right. Okay. And so you can say, you know, regions of the body. Like I'd probably say like, yeah, we had someone just like this recently.

Um, they had, uh, kind of some achy dullness in the back as well as some pain, some shooting stuff kind of into the SI joint, sometimes a piriformis region, like the outer hip. Right. And so they might resonate well with that. One of those types of, uh, things there. And I can say, I can say how that person, how their treatment plan kind of went and their success. And so it's something like that. But, um, and, and the tools we might've used because the tools that you mentioned, they're so general, they don't necessarily mean anything. Yeah. So I had a, this was just recently, actually, I had a, about a 60 year old man that I used to train, uh, personal train years ago before chiropractic school.

And, uh, he, he had generalized low back pain. Um, he had pain down the leg into the SI joint in his eyes. And, uh, I didn't know a lot at that point, you know, I knew what I knew and I was training him and we were performing exercises to kind of buffer his, his pain. And I was sending him to the chiropractor that I knew at the time, which was, um, just kind of a typical chiropractor where you'd have them come in and everyone receives the same adjustment and he was getting pounded on time after time. And he would walk away feeling better. And then the next day come to me saying, yeah, I don't feel any better.

I'm back in pain. So it was kind of this, um, kind of this loop just went back and forth, back and forth. And there's always chasing the symptom. Yeah. So recently, two weeks ago, I went back up to Reno and, uh, I was staying, staying with them because they're also close friends of mine. And we had a training session and I said, why don't we look at your back a different way? Um, I'm not going to adjust you because, you know, I'm still a student, but let's have a training session together. Um, cause I'm still a personal trainer. Um, so I looked at it a little different way based on the things that I've learned, um, recently in Dr. Sebastian's office.

And we basically found that he had an intolerance deflection, um, and he had pain down the back of the leg, typical. And in the SI region, uh, his most provocative maneuver was in the morning, getting out of bed and picking up his cat. So for one, I showed him how to do that properly to breathe and brace and pick up his cat. And then for two, I just put him into the position face down on a table. Like he's reading a book, hung out there for 30 seconds, had him do some press ups into extension. And then we did that for a few sets. He got back up and the numbness and tingling had gone all the way from it originally down to his knee and it was just localized in his low back.

Nice. So it's kind of like a, so it's like a warmup for the remainder of the training session, really. Yeah, exactly. Just the mobility stuff. But, but so a, just to recap on, so that since this whole, this whole, uh, podcast, this, these are, by the way, we're doing, I'm doing sections, different people. Um, if you were to then, if we're going to redo this whole, redo this whole, redo this whole phone call, think about like, so that's a very compelling story. And I can even imagine the guy picking up his cat now, like there's something to create a picture. And so I'm thinking I want to be the, like, I don't want a cat, but I want to be able to pick up a cat well, you know?

And so maybe this collar has the same problem and they also have that same repeating loop. And so now they resonate well with the story you told. Yeah. Much better than the generalized way I was speaking about it before. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So are you ready again? Sure. Ring, ring. Hello. Hey, uh, do you guys take insurance? Um, you know, why don't you tell me a little bit more about your condition and then we can talk about that later. Oh, um, well, you know, I just kind of want to, I don't, I only want to go to someone if they take my insurance. Hmm. Okay. Well, let's speak a little bit about your pain first and that'll give me an idea how we can move forward.

Okay. Um, so yeah, I just got this reoccurring like SI joint thing that I've just been adjusted for weekly and it seems to be helping, um, been doing it for like six months or so. And it's just like, it released my pain for about five days or so. And it's just, I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's like a godsend that I could feel good for five days, you know? Okay. Um, you know, a lot of times SI joint pain can be coming from somewhere else. So I'd, I'd like for you to come in and take a look and we can figure out what, what is causing your pain and what's the generating, what's the generator of your pain.

And then that'll give us a better idea of where to go from there. Okay. So what do you, what do you mean? It could be coming from like another spot. Like it's cause the SI joint, like cause I can feel pain in my SI joint. Yeah. So we see commonly the, the nerves are basically coming out of the low back and they supply all the muscles, um, all the way down to the feet. So if the nerves are angry, they're basically, um, they're basically like food for the muscles. And if the nerves don't have any room to breathe, essentially, then the muscles are going to get angry and aggravated. And the problem is if we treat the muscles or we treat the SI joint, and that's not where the problem is.

We're just covering up the symptom and it's going to come back a couple of days later rather than finding the root cause of where it is. So, uh, yeah, so it's, it really bothers me in the morning more so than anything else. Uh, is that, uh, do you guys work on things like that or like you have good success with that? That's very common. Actually, uh, I had a patient the other day that, um, every morning he gets up and first thing in the morning he goes in and picks up his cat and his low back kills him. So I had a session with him the other day, we did a couple of, uh, couple of examinations and then a couple of movements in the office and retested and this pain was gone.

He reported to me the next day that he picked up the cat and he had no pain at all. Nice. Um, so yeah, the, uh, I have the same kind of thing and I put on my shoes, you know, it's, um, and like my shoes aren't as heavy as a cat, but I like it more than a cat. Um, and, uh, so how long did his, did his, uh, relief last? His relief was immediate for one and then it didn't come back during that day and it's been continual for two or three weeks now without even seeing me more than once. Oh, okay. So, yeah. So you see how that, uh, I'll break character now. You see how it's a little bit more. Yeah.

Okay. But I did add to draw you into the story. I'd volunteer the story a little sooner. Yeah. Cause although I think people want to hear, they, they say they want to hear about all the details of what you're going to do. I think they really, I think they really want to hear that they are going to feel good, that you know what you're doing, that you've seen someone like them before and that, that, uh, that you, that you, that you have success, you know, and they want to resonate well with a, I mean, people like Star Wars and stuff and they like, why do people like R2-D2, you know, maybe they think they're R2-D2, they resonate with a character.

I like that. Yeah. It's way better. Yeah. Questions on this before we close this section? Hmm. Questions. I guess, um, you have better ways of breaking the, I still feel awkward trying to break that first question, first or second question. And I know I'm just like, I haven't heard you on the phone yet trying to continue that conversation. And I know I'm, I'm just kind of steering around, but do you have a better way of? Yeah. It's, it's tough sometimes, but I think, um, I, so we'll do the reverse role. Give me a couple of ring rings. Ring ring. Hi, thanks for calling Performance Place. How can I help you?

Hi, I was wondering, do you guys take insurance? You know, uh, it's a good question. Uh, it depends. What do you have going on? Uh, I have SI joint pain. And I've been getting treated for months and months and temporary relief, but it's still there and I'm seeking other options. Good. Uh, so that's one way. Okay. Just, just get, you can give me another ring ring. I don't, I don't know what to say on these. I'm just going to go off the cuff. Ring ring. Hey, how's it going? Great. How are you? I'm good. Uh, how can, how can I help you? Uh, I'm having a lot of neck pain, you know, and I just was looking to get some answers.

I want to know if you guys take insurance. Hmm. Okay. That's a good question. You know, can I get your number real quick and I'm going to give you a call right back. Okay. Hmm. Okay. Now ring ring. I'm calling you. Hey, how's it going? Hey, so we were talking about your neck. Uh, can you tell me a little bit more about that? Yeah. You know, I've been, uh, getting adjusted now for about three years and it's been on and off. I feel like, uh, I'm getting some relief, uh, but now my neck's kind of popping and clicking all the time and, um, it seems to be getting worse. Nice. And so now I can continue down that route.

So you can, you can refocus them. Okay. So those are, those are different, different options. However, when you do have someone who is a gung ho, like, uh, uh, like I don't care about that. Tell him about this. And then you try to redirect them. Yeah. But what about this? Like those ones are tougher. And in my experience is just of working, of, of experiencing people like that. They're challenging people anyways. And so I don't mind losing them on the phone. Okay. And I just tell them straight up, I'm like, look, dude, we're like this. Right. And I tell you like, like we don't take insurance or I tell them percentage.

I'm like, look, you can try, but I can tell you like less than 10% of the people that ever come here get any insurance money back. I'm going to be straight up with you. Right. We cost this much. And I can tell you already today, all the places you've called, I guarantee I'm the most expensive place that you're going to call today. But I'll tell you why. Right. And so I don't try to beat around the bush. I just tell them the direct answer. Right. And sometimes it sometimes doesn't work, but it's, it's, it's, it's, you gotta, you gotta get around the question or just get straight through it. Don't even beat around the bush.

Yeah. I like that. Cool. So I'm guessing you have people sometimes they just hang up. Sometimes. Yeah. But it's, um, I, I attempt to, I, this is why I have an answering service right now. I, cause I do this, I do basically do the second on second what I did with you is so they'll ask, they'll, they'll ask that almost all the time. I'll show you on the, uh, the intake things on the, on the answering service. They'll ask that all the time, but also to talk about the region, the complaint. Hey Joe, how's it going? Uh, you called my office, my answering service said that you were talking about, uh, you have some neck issues.

Can you tell me more about that? You know, like they could, they could pull the exact opposite on me. Yeah. I called actually about insurance. Okay. Well, let me see if I'm the correct place for you first, you know, or, or you can do the reverse kind of reverse sell on it. It's like, uh, you know, tell me a little bit more about your neck because first off I can tell you, I'm really, I'm really bad at treating certain types of neck pain. And so let me ask you a little bit more about yours because I might be the wrong place for you. Hmm. Yeah. I like that. Okay. Yeah. A lot of different ways. I do think the callback is brilliant because you can approach it with, I'm calling to hear about your issue or your pain, what's going on right now, rather than avoiding the question, the first question.

Yeah. They're tough, but you got to be willing to also not take a message on those two, you know? Yeah. So, well, cool. Thanks for doing that part. Time to go home and practice for next time. Ring, ring. Oh my God. Performance place. This is Nathan. How can I help you? Hey, uh, how much for a quick adjustment? Um, what, what are you dealing with? Well, you know, I've been having this low back issue that like adjustments just seem to work for me. My, my chiropractor just left town for the week. Okay. How, how long have you been dealing, having this low back problem for? Um, gosh, it's probably been about five years now.

Five years. And, uh, does it, how often do you see your chiropractic for adjustments? Uh, we, we do about once every, uh, or actually we do a couple of times a week most of the time, but, um, that's why when he just left for like a week or so, like I thought I needed to get in to see somebody. Okay. Um, do you, I think it, I think you can keep thinking there. I think as you guys can tell, uh, we practiced this before. So he recognized the ring ring. Uh, so we'll give him a chance to gather his thoughts cause this is a, still a work in progress. So when you get, when you get adjusted, you get some temporary relief.

I do just make sure to eat that mic a little bit. Um, yeah, I, I do. Um, and it tends like it feels like, I feel like it feels like looser, you know, and I'm able to go out and do stuff like the next day. Usually that day I don't do a lot, but you know, it's just a couple of days of relief. Yeah. Okay. Like a really good relief. Um, yeah, well, uh, there's chiropractor adjustments can, can definitely help with, uh, some temporary pain relief. Um, I would be more interested in, in finding out what's going on. And why, why you're having this back pain and why it keeps coming back. Um, I'd have to do an exam in order to, to check that out, but that's really part of the process.

You know, I would like to try to see if we could get rid of this, uh, permanently for you and, and, and rather rapidly. Um, and I think that that could be a possibility depending on what we're dealing with. So, um, what, uh, I guess a couple of things in that, what do you mean permanently? And, uh, and second is, is I, can I just like, I know, I know what's wrong with me. So can we just pass that exam? Well, do you, do what, so what is wrong with you? What, what do you, what do you, so I just have like a little arthritis down there, you know, and, uh, I tend to get out of alignment some. And so I just, it just, it's, it's just kind of like been there for a long time.

And, and we've done some x-rays and it shows that's what it is. And I've done an MRI and, and nothing's really that wrong with it. But, uh, so yeah, it's just, I mean, everyone's telling me that's, that's what it is. So do I really need to do an exam? Uh, for sure. I mean, I, I, if I see any new payment patient, I have to do an exam. Otherwise I'm, I'm liable and there's, there's malpractice concerns. I have to be able to do my own, um, uh, uh, diagnosis assessment. Um, but just because you have arthritis doesn't mean that's your pain generating tissue either. And usually with arthritis, there's disc issues and yeah, even alignment issues that can often involve, uh, nerve compromise and things like that.

And, um, adjustments don't necessarily always hold those, those changes permanently, which is why you have to keep going in and adjustments can be very powerful. But, uh, all alone, is your doctor doing anything else for you or is it, or are they just doing adjustments? We do some, we do some STEM, uh, and, and heat every once in a while, but I'm, I really liked it. It's like, it's real quick, you know, I'm just standing out and just get an adjustment. I feel good for a couple of days and so, and it's, uh, I don't know. It just seems like, um, is that like, can I, can I do that with you? Or it sounds like you're trying to do something different.

Yeah, I, I, I kind of am. I'm actually, you know, I would have some concerns with having, if you're getting, and I don't, I'm going to be very honest with you. Um, when, when you get adjustments repeatedly, many times a week, that can often cause a little bit more instability in the area over the longterm and keeping you seeking, needing more and more adjustments. And it's not really the way that I want to help people. I want to empower them to be able to kind of get rid of their pain and be able to go and live their life freely. Um, I, I don't know if that's something that would interest you or not, but that's kind of what I, I would like to do for you.

So, so what would that like other than, cause I'm only used to, I'm, that's, I'm used to getting adjustments in tissue, uh, sorry, uh, icing and, and stem is, so what, what does that look like? Cause it seems kind of, I just don't know what you're saying. Well, once I, once I figure out if there's some other tissues that are involved in there, there certainly are with, with arthritis and what's causing, um, the, the, the movement dysfunctions in your, in your segments, uh, being at a line, whether, whether it's, uh, from, uh, a mechanical issue, uh, like when you, if you're moving in a specific direction and for whatever reason your spine can't hold alignment in that, that, uh, direction that can, um, be a conflicting factor with, with maintaining, um, the alignment and functionality of your spine.

And so if, if we don't look at the active components and the whole, and the whole picture of, of stabilizing your spine, then you're, you're just going to keep kind of going on repeat over and over again. And eventually you want to be able to, to, to stabilize your spine with your own ability and your own muscles and your own function and kind of learn how to do that. And I'm, I'll, I'll teach you how to do that, but first we need to figure out exactly what's pulling what out of place and, um, what tissues are really irritated by the arthritis and why this keeps coming back. Cause I, I want to be, I want to figure out why this has not gone away.

Um, if I'm, if I'm treating you well and, and historically with my patients, that's, that's what I get. I get someone comes in with pain, whether it's been, you know, a few years or whether it's acute and, and right away, I kind of figure out what's exactly going on. I do a very thorough exam. It can take an hour and a half if it needs be. And, um, and within five or six visits, I like to see, uh, I like to see resolution in the longterm so that I don't have to see you again, unless you have something else that comes up, which I can help you with. Um, and that's, that's my main goal. I don't want to keep you stuck having to come back over and over, over again.

I just want to figure out what's going to fix you and stick and get you out and on your way. Okay. So, um, let me then, uh, um, let me go talk to my wife and see, I'll just keep your ring back. Okay, sure. Yeah. Let me know. Um, uh, and, uh, yeah. And give us a call back. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Okay. Um, what, since we replayed this game, where do you think you could improve on that whole thing there? Um, here's step up to the mic. Yeah, for sure. Um, I could have, I could have drank coffee this morning. You gotta be on game. These things are, so everyone knows I just surprised them. I said, let's go in the podcast room.

Okay, cool. We're going to do this. Um, cause of the phone calls come. So, uh, yeah, I mean, there's a lot of things, obviously not stumbling around on myself as much, um, being able to describe what I was, what my end game is, is much quicker and getting to the point of that, uh, faster, um, trying not to throw his doctor under the bus, um, which, you know, it was kind of heading that direction a little bit, but wasn't sure how to kind of navigate the, uh, um, you know, I just want the quick fix for a couple hours thing on the spot. Um, and I guess I could, I could, could have asked him if I could have asked him if he wanted to, if he wants to keep getting, you know, just a couple hours or a couple days of relief, or if he wants to find a more long-term solution.

Yeah, I think, I think that's fair. And I don't think if you put someone on the spot with that type of question, I think most times it'd be difficult for them to respond. Even if that is attractive, that quick kind of fix in and out. Okay, I'm good for a couple days. Um, is, is very attractive to a lot of people psychologically. They don't have to think about things. They can just let someone else take care of it. They can get some symptom relief and then just go back in another day. Why not? Um, so, I mean, if the, if the thing of money came up where I'm sure his chiropractor is probably a lot cheaper and ours was more expensive, uh, another route that I could have gone with is like, well, yeah, we're, we're more expensive than this.

But again, you know, our goal is to get you gone and, and, and, you know, six to seven visits where at max, where, you know, your current chiropractor may be a quarter of the price, but you've been seeing him twice a week for five years. How much money is that? Yeah. Um, and, and trying to do that as diplomatically as possible. Um, I'm not trying to steal him from his current chiropractor. Um, it's hard to kind of also describe the risks of getting adjustment over and over again for, for two years straight to five, some years straight for twice a week without really throwing the other chiro under the bus, but, um, and kind of shaking his whole worldview of what chiropractic is.

That, that is, that is a tough thing. Cause it's like the, like, so I assume some patients from, uh, um, uh, from Cody Dimak in, in Harrington. And so it's like, so we talked about like what these patients are going to like, like where they're at mentally. And it's like, there's like some of them, it's like, okay, so this person's going to come in, they love their PT. So whatever you say, like you're brand new, they love their PT. So emotionally attached to that person. Yeah. And that's okay, you know, but it's like, so, and if you throw that person under the bus that they're emotionally attached to and they love, you're going to push them away as well.

Right. And you can't help this person. And, uh, but yeah, I, there's a, I think there's a fine line of like, like, Hey, Hey, the dude that you're seeing with is not helping you versus like, Hey, let's try something different, but it's gotta be compelling enough to get them over. And when I was stumbling over, like trying to describe, you know, the functionality of the back in terms that languaging that he understands from what his chiropractor has, has probably been talking to him about. That's a good idea. Um, I was trying to do that, but I probably should have just jumped in quick with some stories, probably storytelling questions about, Oh, how is that?

That would be a window to give an example of an anonymous patient and a few that where they came in with similar cases or whatever. And, and how, how we resolve their problem, how we went through that process and, and what their results were and how it came for the better. Yeah, I think, I think so. Like, so I was like, so as I had to respond, right. And so actually when you went on the long part about, uh, like, how's that different? Like, I don't understand what you're talking about. Uh, I actually zoned out for a sec, you know, in which, which I know what you're talking about, but then they're going to be gone quicker.

Yeah. So, um, but it's a learning process. We've been doing that. We've been doing this for like three weeks now on and off randomly. Yeah. And it's just, it's tough. It's a tough thing. Especially with that particular dynamic with the guy that has been seeing his adjustment based chiro. His idea of chiropractic medicine is you just come in, they do a quick palpation of, of a sticky joint and put you back into alignment. Um, and if, and if you're really back in alignment, then you, you're not in pain in two or three days, quote unquote alignment, um, whatever that means, uh, to probably get a thumbs down on this podcast some more.

Um, by the way, thumbs up any, if you like to say what he's saying. Um, so why don't you, I'll give you the potential to, so I interviewed, uh, uh, uh, I don't remember if he had the name or not, or I won't release the name. I interviewed somebody else and I gave him the potential to, uh, uh, interview me back with this and so would you like to ring, ring me? Cause I don't feel like, I don't want, I know it's tough being on the spot with that. So I don't want, yeah. Okay. Um, okay. Uh, ring, ring. Hey, thanks for calling before this place. How can I help you? Uh, yeah, I was, I was wondering how much, um, a quick adjustment would be.

Hmm. You know what? You know, can I get your phone number real quick? I'm going to call you right back. Uh, I'm going to be, I got a couple of minutes in a little bit, but right now I got, I actually do had a rush off. Can I have the number? Yeah. Uh, five, five, five, five, five, five. Cool. What's your name? Uh, my name is Nathan. Great. Cool. All right. I'll call you back. Ring, ring. Uh, yes. Hi. Hey, is it Nathan? Yes. Hey, earlier you called and you're, you're talking, uh, you're, you had a problem with the area of your body that you wanted to ask me about. Is there, is there an issue you're dealing with?

Is it Sebastian Gonzales? Uh, yeah, yeah. I, I got, uh, you know, I, I usually see, um, a chiropractor who's, who's currently out of town for a couple of weeks and I just, I get, I get these headaches. Um, and I just need a quick adjustment cause that always, that always takes them away. And I got, I got one right now and I was hoping I could just come in and, um, and get an adjustment so I could, I could go on with my day for the night, you know, and, and get rid of this headache. Okay. So, um, just let me ask you a couple of questions first if that's okay. Cause there's, cause honestly, like I've had headaches come in here before and they don't respond.

And so I just want to make sure that you're not in that category cause I want to make sure I can't help you. They don't respond to what? They just don't respond to what we're, what we do, you know? Um, what do you do? Um, well, it depends what you have. So, um, if, if you want, if you want to allow me to, can I ask a couple of questions? Cause, cause again, if this is the wrong place, cool. Um, is it, where does it go in your head? Oh, it starts, it starts on the back of my head. Um, like down below the ear, I guess the sub suboccipital region, that area. Um, uh, and, and then it kind of travels over and goes to the top of my head, um, and above my eye or sometimes I can feel like it's just a band beneath the base of my head or the back of my skull.

And then sometimes it transitions to like a band that's above my eyes. Okay. Is, uh, is there any tightness anywhere in like the shoulder blades or like notice the arm? Yeah, I get, I get tightness in my shoulders and in my neck. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. You know, I think, um, at least based on what you told me right now, like I, without doing an exam, I can't honestly tell you what's going on with you cause I don't know yet. But if you respond like another person we had here, I remember I had this one lady here, she was an interesting case actually. So she had leg pain as well as she had some, such as some terrible headaches.

And so, um, I was concerned more about her legs actually, cause it's a more severe symptom. Headaches are, uh, headaches are terrible to have, but at that time the leg was more important. And so actually all we did was a simple, we actually didn't even adjust her. All we did was how we lifted the skin right around like the area of the base of the skull and her symptoms completely went away. And it was crazy, right? And cause it only works like how half the people that you do it with. But that was, that's an example of something like really simple that she went home with and she did that daily just for about a couple reps a day.

And actually after that time, she really didn't have any neck pain she was complaining about. So we can really work with her leg. You know, how does, how does that work? How does lifting the skin relieve? It's funny, huh? Neck pain. So headache pain. So headaches are, um, so nerves, a lot of times nerves will create headaches and sometimes nerves will create like mid back burning type of stuff or mid back dull aches. Or, um, I know a lot of people think of nerves as like stabbing, shooting, electrical, like, um, numbness, things like that. And those are all attributes of nerve issues. But a lot of times just the dull throbbing headache can be a nerve based thing.

And nerves really don't like two things. They don't like to be stretched too far and they don't like a lot of pressure. And sometimes when the nerve is a little bit irritated, like in a, maybe a chronic case like yours, then we have the possibility that just the skin pressure on the nerve, which is under the skin is too much. And it creates the referred symptoms on the eye. Do adjustments do the same thing? They, they kind of, cause that's, that's what, you know, my chiropractor kind of alludes to is that there's, you know, that it's a little bit about alignment and there's, there's some compression on the nerves possibly, um, that can cause some, some head pain or cause my muscles to get tighter, which, which refers to my head.

Right. Um, and the adjustments seem to be very effective at, at resolving that. So a lot of times, so yeah, nerve pain can create all the stuff you're talking about. And so, um, so you guys, right. There, there is an aspect of there that, that when you address the spine, it can reduce the symptoms actually pretty well. But I usually tell people, at least on the phone that, um, and cause I want to make sure that, again, I questioned in the beginning because I want to make sure that, that we understand each other, that, that if you're coming in, you're going to find a really good result, like really good.

Uh, if you're the type of person that I can help you with, and if you can't, then, then maybe I'm doing the wrong thing. But typically for me, um, I expect really good results and I mean lasting results. And so people who have these types of symptoms that you're mentioning, I expect within like probably five times or so, you're just like, it's not just like, wow, this is getting better. It's been on and off. It's like, dude, this is so good. I haven't felt this good in a long time. Like I don't wake up with a headache. I don't have headaches after long days. Like these are things that it's like, um, or it's just localized to the neck now.

And even a lot of times the mid back burning goes away. And so those are the type of results that I would expect. And I might or might not use an adjustment. There's different things for different things in different, uh, uh, situations. And so I just have to evaluate you a little bit with this kind of like reading a book that is you. And so if I read that book, I'll know what's going on right now. I'm just flipping to a central page. I have no idea. Like I can guess, but if you allow me to read that book, then I can probably help you. And if adjustments work and it works for a couple of days, great.

But again, the lasting results, and this goes for if you're going anywhere, me or somebody else, it should be like, dude, like five, six times, like, oh my God, like I found this guy. Right. And so that's the type of experience I want you to have here. So it's totally up to, up to you. I might or might not adjust you quite honestly. Okay. Um, well, how much, how much would, would this evaluation be in, in treatment? Do you do treatment the same day that you evaluate? Most of the time. I mean, there is some, uh, some circumstances where I don't, but most of the time, yes. Um, in complex cases, I got to spend a little bit more time doing X, Y, and Z, because if you're going down one path, it doesn't mean it's the right path.

There's, there's many different paths. And so I just got to figure out what's going to work for you. Um, typically we find the right path on the first day. Um, the cost is going to be more than any place you call today, quite honestly. And I tell, I tell you that cause I don't want you to be surprised when you walk in, you're like, this guy's way more than, than other places. I know I am like I acknowledge, and I want you to know I am because, but I believe there's a reason. Okay. I spent a ton of time figuring out what route you should take. And like I said, those are results that I expect. All right.

And so with that being said, you, uh, my price is X, um, and, and, and it does get cheaper from there. Okay. It gets way cheaper from there, but we spend a ton of time in the beginning, just figuring out what's going on with you. Right. And if you've ever been concerned that you have cancer or migraines, or if there's food aspects with your headaches, and maybe you thought, maybe I should be gluten free and maybe it's the neck issue, or maybe it's a pinched nerve. I'm going to screen all that out. Right. You're going to know definitively by the time you leave, what's going on with you. Okay. So no more guessing, but we are more expensive.

All right. That is, that's a little, that's definitely much higher than I was planning on, on, on, uh, you know, and definitely more than I was planning on embarking in, in multiple ways this week. Cause I just kind of was hoping I could just find someone that could, you know, just get rid of this thing for the week so I can keep moving on. But, um, I mean, I, I, I, I can see the benefit and maybe digging a little deeper, but I definitely did not have any plans and anticipate. Do you don't, you don't take insurance or is this something that insurance could help, help cover the basis of? It might.

Do you, do you feel like you have a good insurance? Uh, yeah, I have pretty good insurance. Okay. So, so I'll give you the rough estimation on this. And again, this is like, I have no control over the insurance pays anything or not. Right. They are their own entity. It's kind of like you asking mom to pay for your care and mom's like, I don't want to pay. Right. And so it's totally up to them, but I can help you guide you the process, however you need. But I'll give you the rough estimation. Probably about 15% of people who come into this office ever get any penny back from insurance. Everybody else pays cash.

Right. Uh, I do have the one gentleman that he pays X amount and he gets X amount back. Right. And they just send it directly to him and we give them all the necessary paperwork. It's not that much. You just put a stamp on it and you send it off to your insurance. Right. And so if you have great insurance, there's a better possibility with it. Right. And so other people have really bad insurance. I personally have really bad insurance and I pay like $500 a month for it, but it doesn't cover anything. And so it's, it's, uh, it's totally up to your insurance plan. I have no idea quite honestly, but we're not in network with any of them.

All right. Um, you know, I, I, like I said, this, this was not something that I was planning to kind of, uh, uh, spend or, or go through this week. Um, but, uh, I understand, you know, I'm hearing, you know, the possible value that you're, you're bringing to the table, but I'm going to have to need to think about this for a minute. Okay. Um, so can I call you back? Well, do you want, do you want my, my front office guy can actually ring you back? And, uh, but we actually have actually, you know what, you know, might be helpful is, uh, do we have a website with a ton, like it's a ton of free information on it.

And in fact, there's this little mini guide on there, which kind of walks you through like all the necessary information that you should probably should know as you go through this journey that is getting rid of your headaches. And so for all the people who, who don't want to pay X amount, that thing's on there. All right. I used to give them out for free, but usually when I gave them out for free, no one will look at them, but there is free resources on there. There's a paid version, which is like under 20 bucks, or there's obviously me for X amount. And so, uh, if possible, can I, can I have my front office guy actually email you that direct link so you don't have to go search for it?

Yeah. Yeah, sure. What's your email? Um, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Oh, cool. Well, great. Oh, great. .org. Um, great. And so let me just leave you with this thing. Cause like, cause honestly, I'm not trying to sell you on coming in. I'm just like talking to you as a human with this is like, if you're not finding a lasting change where you're going, whatever it is, whether you're going to me or somebody else, like quite honestly, a lot of these things aren't that hard. They're not that hard. People just make them hard, right? Or they seek inefficient care and the care is just enough to make them feel good for a little bit of time.

So they keep going, you know? And so do me a favor, like wherever you go, make sure that five or six times is like, dude, like, this is good. Right? And so I want you to have that response. So if you don't somewhere else, just come on back. All right. Sounds, sounds fair. Cool. Talk to you soon. Thanks. Thanks for talking to me. Click. All right. So I encourage you guys to do that ring ring game. It's going to be a good time. And just to recap on a couple things here is that so I'm still, let's say we're still thinking about having that workshop here. Okay. And if you guys listen to past podcasts around, probably around the month of May, you realize that I put, did put on a workshop here.

I called it offloading musculoskeletal and neurological pathology. And it's basically the idea is to be able to get people to feel better without actually, I guess, quote unquote, really touching them. And you might wonder, well, how's that possible? Well, it is possible. And it's basically just a redistribution of what their body is mechanically doing, I guess, to decrease the amount of load on the area of concern. I know a lot of you have thought, well, like, well, this person has plantar fasciitis. How do we, what do, should we boot them? Well, that's one way of offloading, or you can just get the body to offload it automatically.

And so that really comes in figuring out how you're going to offload this person's symptom generating structure. And so when I did the last one, I had a great time. Like, we all had a good time. Like, we spent Saturday just doing all the stuff in-house here. A lot of great questions, a lot of gems that dropped. I actually learned a couple things, too. And I know that from the text message I got from people later, they said that they were able to implement the stuff, and it was great. And so now I think they need to improve on their loading strategy because they were able to offload, but in my interpretation is they could have gone a little bit more aggressive with some of them and maybe got them into a resistance training type of load.

And so we did that Saturday as well as Sunday. And Saturday, we went back over to my place, which is about a mile from the office, and we barbecued some tomahawk steaks. And we actually had some beer, had a ton of, I guess, was that hors d'oeuvres? It would be appetizers. Tons of appetizers, and people were out there about until 10 o'clock just having to go the whole time. It wasn't a slosh fest, just everyone being just having fun. And so I'm proposing that we do this again. And this time would be for no CEs, no con ed, and no student discounts because there is a student workshop that, let's see, by the time this one drops here, it's probably going to be like next week.

And so there's the student workshop is accelerated. It's six hours that we're talking about, and it's under $200 for you guys, I think. And it's really dependent upon how many come because you guys are paying me a flat rate. And for the docs, though, it's going to be in a complete day, and we'll go to a little bit more advanced stuff. But for the most part, if you guys are interested in this stuff and you really want to up your rehab game, get through your corrective exercise really quickly with people. Have a decreasing amount of time of manual therapy that you do, including your active release, your myofascial work, your adjusting, and basically time that you spend on the table, which I consider is a bottleneck in regards to patient care, which does have usefulness.

But for the most part, I think it's a business bottleneck because you can only do it, right? And I really get the patient to become empowered. If you're looking to get them empowered, get them back to the sport really quickly and be able to get them to monitor, decrease their symptoms really quickly and desensitize tissues that have become overloaded, I can show you how to do that, all right? It's really not that hard, but a lot of times people just don't know what to do yet. Docs don't know what to do yet. And so I'll show you clear communication strategies of how to do that, and I think you guys are going to walk away with some really, really good gems.

So what I want to do is I want everybody to, if you're interested in this, just reach out to me on Instagram or on email. And email is seb at p2sportscare.com. Instagram is at performancehb, and I'll send you all the details there. I don't want to overload you with conversation and details on this because, quite honestly, they might change a little bit. I like to do things on a Google Doc just so it changes as you guys get it, so you get the most updated stuff. And so we're going to cover things like hip impingement, hip flexor syndrome, myralgia parasitica, low back pain, runner's knee, hamstring strains, foot issues, let's go even into plantar fasciitis, Achilles tendonitis, heel pain, or even metatarsal, metatarsalgia.

And so all these things are really not that complicated to work on. And as I always tell patients all the time, if you're not finding it as significant, like, dude, I feel good type of feeling within about five sessions or so, you've done the wrong thing. You haven't done your homework or I've picked incorrectly. And so I think as clinicians, we can provide them with these types of strategies without even really touching them if we know what we're doing. And so if you're interested in this, please contact me because I want to help you guys along, and I'd love to learn from you as well, and I'd just love to meet you.

And so as always, lead people better than how you found them if you're dating, dating Eagle Scout, and I'll see you guys later. Thank you.